Did Cass testify?

Talkin' to your toothbrush...& other Cass Elliot Friends!

Moderators: Admin, Rbcsoup

Did Cass testify?

Postby jcg » Fri Jun 21, 2013 10:41 am

Did Cass testify at the Manson trial?:

http://www.themusicnetwork.com/music-fe ... the-papas/

(story has been removed--Dec 04, 2014)

I know that the Manson Family had partied at Cass' house and Susan Atkins claims in her new book "The Myth of Helter Skelter" that Cass herself taught her how to make brownies; but, I had no idea that she allegedly testified at the trial. Does anyone know if she did or not? There's no mention of her in Bugliosi's book.
jcg
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:11 pm

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby Rbcsoup » Mon Jun 24, 2013 5:34 am

Actually, I think the possibility of her testifying (as well as that of John) is in Bugliosi's book. At any rate, she was on a witness list but did not testify. As far as Atkins' claim, Susan Atkins' veracity has not always been 100%. Having said that, Pic Dawson was very mixed up with the Manson Family AND the Manson girls were hangers-on at a lot of musicians' homes during 1968-69. Abigail Folger and Cass did seem to be friendly ans Abigail and her boyfriend Voytek lived near Cass before going to Sharon Tate's. Listen to "Strange Young Girls" on the 2nd LP. I always think it paints a decent musical picture of the scene. Of course Twelve-Thirty does too.
Rbcsoup
 
Posts: 220
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 6:40 am
Location: Virginia

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby Nicole » Mon Jun 24, 2013 7:25 am

Hi jcg,
The Manson murders were one of the most horrific crimes of the 20th century. I always try to keep in mind the people behind the headlines who were so wounded by this sesnseless act of violence. If you wish to read further, Sharon Tate's niece, Brie Tate, wrote a book called Restless Souls that deals with everything her family went through in the aftermath and beyond. Also, for an update on the particulars of the case, and in my humble opinion, an objective view, you can also read Greg King's Sharon Tate and The Manson Murders.
Take care,
Nicole :mrgreen:
User avatar
Nicole
 
Posts: 1164
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:36 am

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby jcg » Wed Jun 26, 2013 10:12 am

Dear Richard and Nicole,

Thank you so much for the info. As this forum is for celebrating the ray-of-sunshine that was Cass, I am always hesitant about bringing up some of the darker moments; however, once again, you guys help solidify my belief in this site as a valuable research tool also.

Richard: I agree. The group definitely had an uncanny finger on the pulse of the zeitgeist of the mid-to-late 60s. Canyon and Girls are perfect examples of this. All the accounts I've read from the group members highlight how close they were to 4 of the 5 victims and, in the case of John, to being there that terrible evening. And yes; it is hard to believe Susan Atkins. Thanks for keeping the site up and please help us get Don't Call Me Mama Anymore released!

Nicole: Thanks for the books; I have read them. In case you hadn't seen it, go to www.sharontate.net and see what Sharon Tate's remaining sister says about this book. Among others, she rebuts that Paul Tate--Sharon's father--interviewed Cass and John Phillips himself. Also, thanks for consistantly providing discourse on this site. Your insight and obvious love shines through in earth tones.

Peace,
jcg
jcg
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:11 pm

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby Nicole » Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:51 am

Hi jcg,
Thank you, I will check it out. I didn't even know that Sharon Tate's sister maintained a website. Also. thanks for your kind words. Have a great weekend.
Take care,
Nicole :mrgreen:
User avatar
Nicole
 
Posts: 1164
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:36 am

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby Richard » Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:20 am

I'm surprised to learn that Cass was acquainted with Manson's family. It sounds like it was probably earlier on before anyone could have predicted the dangerous turn this group took. It sounds like John and Michelle were acquainted too, if Manson's family camped outside their home. I did read they cost Dennis Wilson (Beach boys) thousands of dollars for various reasons, before his manager asked the Family to move away from his premises. Does anyone know, of the many books written about Manson, is there one in particular that mentions Cass and the other M&P's :?: Thanks, Rich.
Richard
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:07 am

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby Richard » Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:36 am

I've copied and pasted the following from letsrollforums.com

Sammy Davis Jr was at Sharon Tate's house the night of the murders along with Mama Cass Elliot but missed being killed by only a few hours. They both had to fly out to separate concerts. Mama Cass Elliot had thrown the Manson Girls out of her house a few months earlier in Laurel Canyon. So she was an enemy of the Manson family and missed being killed when they arrived. John Phillips the founder and song writer of the Mamas and the Papas was also an enemy of the Manson Family. He didn't like Manson and didn't want to record his music. He was invited to Sharon Tate's home the night of the murders but decided not to go.

Can anyone confirm or deny if any of this is true. I know some sites aren't always gospel. Thanks, Rich.
Richard
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2011 11:07 am

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby jcg » Fri Jun 28, 2013 10:35 am

Hi Richard,

In addition to Dennis Wilson, Manson had penetrated the LA music scene through Terry Melcher who, in addition to being one of the sponsors of the Monterey Pop festival, was a close friend of John and Michelle's and lived in the house where the murders would eventually happen at the time he met Manson. Since the Manson family were all up and down both Laurel and Benedict Canyon during the 60s, and Cass was the Gertrude Stein of that era, it became inevitable that their paths would cross; and, all evidence suggests that they indeed did. All, if not most, of the books on this case mention Manson's connection with the music world in general, and Cass and the Phillips in particular. Strangely, Roman Polanski first suspected John Phillips as the killer due to Polanski's affair with Michelle and actually confronted him at knifepoint about it--all covered in John's autobiography. The recent Atkins book mentions Cass specifically.

Also, if everyone who claimed that they were supposed to be at Sharon Tate's house that evening had actually gone, the killers would never have been able to get through. It seems to impart some kind of cultural credibility to claim connections to that event. The truth is that a heavily and uncomfortably pregnant woman and her house guests had a quiet dinner at El Coyote and went home to bed. No parties at all.

peace,
jcg
jcg
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:11 pm

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby jcg » Fri May 02, 2014 12:25 pm

Rbcsoup wrote:Actually, I think the possibility of her testifying (as well as that of John) is in Bugliosi's book.


Hi Richard,

You are correct; Cass is mentioned in Bugliosi's Helter Skelter. On Page 376 of the original Norton hardback (page 510 of the Bantam mass-paperback edition), Defense Attorney Paul Fitzgerald specifically names Cass as a potential trial witness, in addition to John Phillips and John Lennon. For some reason, her name is not included in the book's index.

take care,
jcg
jcg
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:11 pm

Re: Did Cass testify?

Postby jcg » Thu Dec 04, 2014 3:07 pm

Hi all,

This last August was the 45th anniversary of the murders and I DVR'd a couple of commemorative documentaries from various satellite channels, then forgot about them. Due to a bad cold that forced me into bedrest, I went back and watched some of my archived shows. In one, Hollywood Scandals: Charles Manson, author Marlin Marynick, who has a book out called Charles Manson Today, claims that Cass and Manson were, and I quote, "best friends!" This is a bigger claim than that they just knew each other and is the first time I've heard this. Unfortunately, because it is a video documentary, Marynick does not cite sources to back up his assertion.

Don't know what to think about this; but, I felt it relevant enough to pass on.

take care,
jcg
jcg
 
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:11 pm

Next

Return to General Cass Elliot Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

cron